Last night 5 of us were on our way back from dinner. It was my wife and I, another couple and another close friend of our who is pregnant. Let’s call her Beatrix. Very near where a few of us live, a mid-twenties middle-class-looking individual began swinging a grocery back with a bottle of vodka in it at us for no apparent reason. He ended up hitting our pregnant friend in the face causing considerable blood loss and trauma. While Jeff’s wife was taking her home, Jeff and I were making sure the individual wasn’t going to follow them or proceed with any further shenanigans.

He was obviously on some sort of drugs and acting unreasonably and unpredictably. ‘Jeff’ and I simply blocked the path as to not let him pass, as he was constantly attempting to approach the girls. After a bit of arguing and stuff, he began to threaten that he was going to “shoot us in the face and stab us” if we attempted to detain him, then spouted some racial slurs at Jeff and I. My wife called the police.

There were a few times when I thought he was going to get violent again, and I must admit that it crossed my mind more than once to simply beat the shit out of him. Jeff was thinking about somehow detaining him until the police arrived, but I thought it best to just diffuse the situation as quickly as possible.

He finally decided to leave, the opposite direction from us, and the police arrived about 10 minutes later at Beatrix’s house, where we were all taking care of her and preparing to take her to the ER. I went with the police to show them the crime scene and to drive around looking for him. We didn’t find him, but they did recover the top of him smashed vodka bottle which had fallen from the bag. The bottle had been opened and the police said they would be able to extract his DNA from it, but it would take 4-5 weeks to get back.

He was not found that night, but the police have a very clear description of him.

Ever since I began reading material from Shane Claiborn, author of The Irresistible Revolution, I have been challenged by his strict policy of ‘non-violence’. Being originally from East LA I have been in my share of fights, and have never thought twice about having to disable someone if the occasion called for it. Though I don’t think anyone likes fighting, you do actually get used to it if it’s a big feature of your neighbourhood, and for some it is a way of life.

The only Biblical occasion of Jesus being ‘violent’ I can recall is in Matthew 21:12 when Jesus overturned tables, but He didn’t hit anyone. Honestly, though it may be due to the country I was raised in, I don’t understand Shane’s validity of believing in non-violence. I understand the concept of trying to bring The Kingdom of God to Earth, but it’s not here yet, and we still live in a fallen world. Are we supposed to just stand there and let people walk all over us?

Thankfully, in this situation, Beatrix’s husband wasn’t with us, but it really made me think– what if it had been my wife, or Jeff’s? The situation would definitely have turned out differently. I would love to hear anyone’s thoughts on this one.

Theoretically related:



  1. Darrel Lict on Saturday 12, 2008

    I haven’t read this myself, but Jacques Ellul has some very good insights into the Bible… This bit is about violence and Christianity… hopefully it can shed some light , but this subject is very intense especially with very real situations coming up just like the one you are writing about. This is definitely and important area of exploration for us…
    http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/08/ellul/violence.pdf

    I got the link to the book through jesusradicals.com…

  2. Iolanthe Proud on Saturday 12, 2008

    Whatever we decide on this, it can’t be on the basis of our current situation being inherently more dangerous or more fallen and therefore more requiring of violence. I don’t think our society is any more dangerous than any previously. Gandhi and Martin Luther King put themselves in danger to oppose the oppression their people were under. But I suppose that’s the point of “non-violence” – it’s an active strategy. It’s not lying down and allowing yourself to be walked over – it’s publicly standing up for justice and taking the consequences.

  3. DJ Hygiene on Saturday 12, 2008

    I agree– whether or not we adopt non-violence can’t depend upon the situation. It must be based upon a value or moral, therefore transcending individual circumstances. AKA a strategy in itself.

    Where I come from it’s pretty normal to get into fights, and it’s a violent city. In some ways, violence is built into the culture, and I’m sure on that level it’s no different from anywhere else, past or present. But one of the Christian ’causes’ is to CHANGE culture, improve it, rather than accepting it as-is. Because of this, I feel a personal responsibility to understand what my own values and morals are, both as a Christian AND as a human…

    “How do I believe others should be treated?”

    “If my friend is getting beat up by some ruffians what do I do?”

    “If some gun-wielding thief breaks into my house what measures do I take to protect my family?”

    I think in the sphere of Christendom, I probably have a more liberal view of what these answers should be. For myself, I believe people should be treated with respect and love, no matter what status they’re at. But if someone is beating up my friend I’m not going to just stand there and watch it happen. I’m probably going to step in and do something. If some dude with a gun breaks into my home, I’m going to disable him by any means necessary– whether or not he’s actively threatening my family… to me, by breaking in that’s a threat enough!

    But I also want to know Jesus’ love, and be able to apply his life to my own. I want to be able to walk in purity and love, without hurting anyone. It just seems like sometimes there’s really no choice.

  4. DJ EKG on Saturday 12, 2008

    I hear you Hygeine, In my own wrestling and journey with non-violence I’ve come to the point of holding to a philosophy of non-violence in cases of political protest and human rights, at least theoretically. I have yet taken up opportunity to use it. The question I struggle with as well is what about in cases of protecting my wife and family and or a friend.
    As I think about this though, a couple of examples come to mind

    1) Shane Claiborne and one of the neighborhood kids were jumped while walking to the store. Shane shielded the kid with his body and then jumped up and started yelling why are you doing this, you are created in Gods image and so are we and continued speaking out the truth of who they are. When he did this the other kids ran off like they were the ones running from the fight.

    2) Remember the riots and the truck driver that was getting beat up by some gang members. A priest saw it on T.V. and jumped in his car and ran down there. He walked right into the middle of the chaos picked up the truck driver and got him to a hospitable. He did not have to counter assault the other guys at all.

    Non-violence does not mean that we cannot protect ourselves or other people. I think we need to examine what does protecting others look like and what can it look like. Does protecting somebody always mean assaulting the other person. From the above examples, it doesn’t seem so. In fact, I think that most violence done in what is called “protection” may actually be retaliation. Christ did say if you are slapped on one cheek turn the other. Now I don’t think the example given is a life threatening situation. But either way when protecting somebody our priority should be on removing or shielding one person from harm. Also I don’t know that non-violence means we can’t hold somebody back so the other person can get a way either. The question is though have we ever tried actively meeting the assailant with an act of love.
    Also, I don’t know that we have given it a fair chance. What would happen if somebody came in to rob us and we also offered to cook him breakfast or dinner and joyfully offered what we had that he needed or offered to give or find legitimate help for whatever it is that he needed.
    Most crime I think happens as a symptom of some deeper need and lack of something significant. If we can truly love somebody, we become focused on doing what we can to genuinely meet that need. The situation is then reversed where the focus is then on serving the other person than saving ourselves. Once again picking up our cross and laying down our life, that others may know life.
    Let us not forget too the spiritual forces at work. I’ve heard stories of a guy that commanded an assailant in the name of Jesus to drop the gun or something like that and they did. I know this sounds silly to some and not every situation is necessarily like that but its something to be aware of. I think that violence a lot of times may be direct or indirect spiritual forces of darkness. How much power do we really believe lies in the name of Jesus.